Erm...okay - Lee - Nyuszi

Not Quite So Full of Glee

I don't think I've discussed Glee at all, but we're up to episode four and I seem to have a different take on the than many viewers. I haven't found 'Somebody to Love' ;) yet on the show, which may be why I can't seem to work up the same enthusiasm as others. But there is also the writing which I find problematic.


I loved the pilot for Glee. The second episode I found disappointing after the high expectations set by the pilot. Last week's episode I almost turned off because I found the writing, particularly the characterization, a mess and the story boring. This week's episode, 'Preggers' was a big improvement over last week's episode, but I'm still having issues.

The Good

Kurt's storyline suddenly made sense to me. I was frustrated when I thought we were to believe, after Kurt coming out to Mercedes last week, that Kurt was, inexplicably, still in the closet. That people didn't know he was gay. You just can't be that much of a cliche and not have people know you are gay. But, thankfully, we find out it was just Kurt convincing himself that no one knew the truth when, in fact, everyone knew.

I loved Kurt's conversation with his father and his father telling him he's known since he was three. And the moment I most appreciated was when his dad told him that he may not be in love with the idea, but Kurt is who he is and he can't change him.

The Not So Good

The characters are still woefully underdeveloped. They either are one dimensional, cliches, or, most frustratingly, unbelievably stupid. I was shocked when Finn believed he impregnated Quinn, in the hot tub, with their suits on, and with no, um, intimate contact. Or maybe I shouldn't be shocked when he reveals he just discovered you can check books out of a library! SERIOUSLY?

But Finn's just the shining example of an overall problem. Ryan Murphy et al have gone to such extremes with the characters in order to mine humor that the characters are not believable. Will is not much better in the brains department, accepting a store bought belly as his unborn child.

And I'm not sure what they are doing with Rachel. I thought she was supposed to be one of the characters we are meant to identify with, but who want's to identify with such a spoiled, selfish, stuck-up prima donna? She really believes she's entitled to be THE star, but it's a glee club, a team, and she'd rather they all fail then be part of their success.

Oh, and I'm apparently the only one who was bothered by this, but breaking out into dance on the field? It's a fifteen yard penalty! If not a loss of the down! Where were the referees???

The Ugly

I'm rarely a fan of pregnancy storylines on series. Occasionally, pregnancies have to be written in to a series due to an actress's actual pregnancy, and the plot can be handled well (see Phoebe's pregnancy on Friends). Or pregnancy storylines can be done for creative reasons and still work (see Tami's pregnancy on Friday Night Lights). Terri's pregnancy has angered me on several levels and Ive been trying to find ways to deal with it. But now they've made Quinn pregnant as well...with Puck's baby...with Terri trying to acquire it from her. I've seen less convoluted plot lines on soap operas. And I'm also feeling as it the women on this show are shown to be self-serving manipulators while the men are played as sympathetic schmucks.

Because I do enjoy parts of the show, I'm not willing to quit it, yet. But it's definitely being DVR'd from here on out. That way I can fast forward over any scene involving discussion of pregnancy. :p
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I love Glee. Love, Love, Love it with a capital L. Maybe you're expecting too much? It should just make you feel happy watching; I'm sad that it doesn't.

I, personally, don't think anyone's a true cliche. They're all really real with actual personality flaws and opportunity for growth. We supposed to identify with parts of them -- but probably not all of them.

Quinn is supposed to be this mean girl bitch who only cares about making people feel bad and being a cheerleader...but we find out she wants to be successful so she can get out of the rinky dink town she's in. She stood up to her coach 'cause she kind of realized that belittling people doesn't make you better it makes you sadder.

Will was initially painted as Mr. Perfect teacher who cares about his students but we find out he's pretty much as selfish as anyone else -- looking out for his own successes and being just as spiteful as the kids. But sure, he does care -- look at how he cared for Finn.

Puck is the bully (fucking hot, gorgeous, sexy, omg yum!) asshole -- but we realize, hey - he had a deadbeat dad and he's willing to step up and not be the coward.

I HATED Terri in the pilot and kind of loathed her in the 2nd episode, but now I'm starting to feel a little bit sad for her. We find out she really does love Will...really. She feels him slipping away and actually BELIEVED she was pregnant and now feels she's trapped in a no-win situation and desperately doesn't want to lose him.

I could go on, but I need to finish the ad I'm working on...
The point is, there are layers. They're slowing stripping away pieces to reveal more. And even if they weren't or aren't or you don't see it...can't you just enjoy it on a totally superficial level? There are soooo many great one-liners...so many gems of dialogue! And music! And singing and dancing! It's just so delicious!

Let's do this again soon. :)

-- Me
Plenty of shows make me happy just watching them, but, at this point, Glee is not one of them. There are certainly gleeful moments, I enjoyed just about every scene Kurt was in, but the parts don't make up for a wholly satisfying show for me.

I still have a hard time feeling any sympathy or admiration for Puck. OK, he won't abandon his child yet, if he really did get Quinn drunk to sleep with her he's no better than a date rapist.

And I don't see Terri loving Will at all. I'm still trying to figure out why the hell he married her since she treats him like a doormat and makes everything ALL ABOUT HER. And if she truly loved him, she would tell him the truth. Instead, she's building lie on top of lie because she's terrified if he leaves her she'll, OMG!, have to take care and support herself.

can't you just enjoy it on a totally superficial level?

I enjoy plenty of shows on a superficial level (Leverage, Bones, Burn Notice), but I have to care about the characters and, so far, I don't care about any of these people (and usually some character has me hooked by the third episode).
I thought we agreed to never mention her again!

I'm guessing she didn't move fast enough to duck the bucket of water.
I agree with a lot of this, and I too loved Kurt's coming out scene.

And I'm also feeling as it the women on this show are shown to be self-serving manipulators while the men are played as sympathetic schmucks.

This and the paper thin characterization have been my two biggest issues as well, but all the schumcky guys are causing me to a feel sort of a backlash effect where I think they all get what they deserve. The women may be all manipulative and horrible, but the men are all doormats. I don't actually mind the diva-ness of Rachel so much though; I think she can be both sympathetic at times while being a bitch at other times. It actually makes her seem to me like one of the most human character on the show.

I was shocked when Finn believed he impregnated Quinn, in the hot tub, with their suits on, and with no, um, intimate contact

Sadly, I did not find this shocking at all. This is what abstinence-only education has wrought. I fully believe that there are teenagers out there who are truly this naive, because they've never been taught differently.

Oh, and I'm apparently the only one who was bothered by this, but breaking out into dance on the field? It's a fifteen yard penalty! If not a loss of the down! Where were the referees???

Now, here I must part ways with you dramatically! First of all because I think the show is set just to the left of reality, so I'm not looking for realism, but more importantly, this is the only time ever that football was interesting and fun to me! If teams broke out into choreographed dances all the time I could be a sports fan!
but all the schumcky guys are causing me to a feel sort of a backlash effect where I think they all get what they deserve.

That's probably a good way too look at it, but I worry about how they want us to look at characters. The writers are probably oblivious as to how the female characters, particularly Quinn and Terri, are coming off (or else they have major issues), but if they don't tone down some of their behavior I think they run the risk of beginning to alienate their female audience. Maybe they have some wonderful plan to wrap up the pregnancy storyline in the next few weeks (Quinn could miscarry and Terri would be forced to fess up), but if this goes on...I just don't know.

I've heard of plenty of teens who end up pregnant because they believe it can't happen the first time?! But no contact? Does he think when people refer to sperm swimming that they are being literal?

I would have been fine with the dancing as they came out on the field or even during a time out. But fourth and long with one second left on the clock? NO! ;p
I had friends in high school who truly believed that using tampons meant you weren't a virgin anymore. Kids are DUMB when it comes to sex. The Celibacy Club, Finn believing you can get pregnant without penetration...sadly I found all of this to be the most realistic, and relateable to my high school experience, part of the show.

You're not really wrong about the rest, but I do think of the show as ultimately a satirical high school soap, which means the outlandish plots and broad characterizations are a part of the format.

I was actually happy that Rachel was so unsympathetic in the episode because to me she's always come off as a Tracy Flick-esque self-absorbed diva. I kind of worried when I thought they were going to transition her into the sweetheart heroine role. I think we were absolutely meant to hate her actions last night and be on Tina/Mr. Shue's side.
You're not really wrong about the rest, but I do think of the show as ultimately a satirical high school soap, which means the outlandish plots and broad characterizations are a part of the format.

I've tried to watch it with this idea in mind, but ultimately it's not sharp enough or funny enough to be satire. I think there were elements of that in the first two episodes, but it's barely there in three and four. And I barely laughed in this latest episode at all. I liked it, but the first two episodes had me convulsing with laughter. This one, not so much.
I think of the show as a dramady, but they can't have it be a comedy one week and a drama the next (there were perhaps too many issues addressed this week). They need to find a way to balance the two.
I guess my high school was more progressive than I thought because Finn believing that didn't ring true to me at all.

I definitely don't want to see Rachel become the sweetheart heroine. And I believe you sometimes need to be a little selfish and abrasive to achieve your goals. But I'm just not seeing where this 'ME! ME! ME' attitude is coming from. I wish we'd meet her dads and see if maybe they go overboard on the praise and encouragement to the point she's convinced no one is capable of doing what she can do on stage.
"And I'm also feeling as it the women on this show are shown to be self-serving manipulators while the men are played as sympathetic schmucks."

Of course! It's the gay-republican created show for insipid liberals of the season. Desperate Housewives>Ugly Betty>Glee. Thankfully, while the shows go on forever, no one watches them past the first season.

My favorite moment was them finding a way to edit the n word out of the lyrics for Gold Digger for a white dude to sing it. No Broke-EH, Broke-EH! WTF does that even mean? I'm sorry, but Will was right: I'll take disco over contemporary pop any day of the week.
My favorite moment was them finding a way to edit the n word out of the lyrics for Gold Digger for a white dude to sing it. No Broke-EH, Broke-EH! WTF does that even mean?

Well, to be fair, that's the way the song has been edited-for-radio broadcast in many parts of the world. I found it ridiculous they chose a song they had to "edit" but found it amusing that they had Matthew Morrison sing a Kanye West song.
The n word would have been edited out regardless if the singer was white, black, or Hispanic. It's a word that can't be used on network TV or, as Crossoverman pointed out, radio. My problem with the song was it was used in much too literal a way. That whole episode was actually a mess.
And I'm also feeling as it the women on this show are shown to be self-serving manipulators while the men are played as sympathetic schmucks

I think this may be the influence of the producers, who also were the producers/creators of Nip/Tuck. It seems to me they are likely repsonsible for the wacky and somewhat unsavory aspects of the show so far. I'm hoping they give the creator of the show, a little known actor from the Chicago area who actually is using his own memories of being in a glee club, more control. But, they're the ones who gave him a chance, so maybe he doesn't feel he can assert himself yet. I hope he does soon! this show has such potential.
I'm seeing the Nip/Tuck influence and am troubled by it. Much like Ron Moore with BSG, I don't think anyone connected with Glee is trying to be hateful towards women, but they are oblivious to the fact that some of the characterizations and scenarios could be viewed that way?

The show has potential and I don't want to see it squandered.
A lot of people are saying this -- but I'm not sure I get it. There are 'hateful' characterizations of men too - just look at psycho Sandy. And asshole Puck. Neither of them are sympathetic (altho one of them is SUPER hot). And then there's the dumbass who whacked off his thumbs and the dumbass (but sweet) Finn. Besides, not all the girls are harpy shrews - look at: Tina, Mercedes and Emma - they're all completely likeable. It's a mixed bag.