Asta 2

Sine Qua Non

I know most of you won't comment on any of this until at least Friday, but I have to get my thoughts down before they escape me. I've come to realize that BSG may be the only show to get me to go WOO! and WTF? in the same episode. ;)


Finally having been given an episode featuring Lee Adama, you probably expect to read how much I loved and adored the episode. Well, don’t be so presumptuous. I will confess that the Burgundy Shirt of Hotness may be one of the best costuming decisions in the history of this series. Everyone else can keep the towels, I’ll take the shirt. ;)

I don’t want anyone to think I hated or even disliked this episode. This was no ‘Black Market’ or, worse, ‘The Woman, King’. But even with copious amounts of Lee I didn’t love this episode, not like I loved ‘Six of One’ or even ‘Guess What’s Coming to Dinner’. The performances were outstanding. I can see why this episode is the Emmy submission for Jamie, Eddie, and Michael Hogan. It’s their best work of the season. Even Grace, Tricia, Mark, and Richard all had a moment or two to shine. I have to say, this is the best cast of actors I’ve ever watched grace a screen together. But as I was just starting my second viewing of the episode, a phrase popped into my head, “full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.” That statement is an over dramatization. A lot did happen and much of it was significant, but much of it was also expected. There were some unforeseen twists, which I will get to, but Caprica’s pregnancy was already deduced by some over the past couple of weeks and Lee’s presidency many have seen coming since the first season. And Adama acknowledging he can’t live without Laura, I’m not a shipper but, well, it was about time he actually said it.

I’m stating the obvious, but the episode was about four men, Adama, Tigh, Lee, and Romo. At least in the case of three of them, choices made will have ramifications for them and the fleet.

Lee Adama

Or should I say Leland Joseph Adama. I do have an issue with just finding out now that Lee’s name is actually Leland. Putting aside, as part of the military, his legal name would have been used on numerous occasions, Kara never once mocked him about this? I find that hard to believe. But, I have to say, I like the name. Maybe because my assumption is it’s a family name and my dad got tagged with the middle name, Hart. It also has a nice presidential ring to it. ;) Most importantly, I can live with the name. I had much worse case scenarios in mind after hearing Lee wasn’t his real name.

Lee Adama is president. When the time came I thought I would have a lot to say about this. I find I don’t have a lot to say about this. I might in time. He hasn’t been tested yet. And I am sooooo looking forward to the conversation between him and Laura when she returns to the fleet. (That’s not a spoiler, just an assumption on my part.)

Before Lee is selected for the office, Romo remarks that they (the Quorum) is looking for an “understudy”, a perfect choice of word since that is what Lee has been, whether he realizes it or not, since the day Captain Apollo met Laura Roslin. I can also accept Lee stepping into this role now, before he’s really ready, not just because he’d have his father’s support as well as the Quorum’s and Zarek wouldn’t argue bitterly against the nomination, but because it is an interim position. Unless he intends to lead another coup or toss aside the ideals he presented to Laura and Adama in ‘Bastille Day’, he will step down as soon as Laura is back.

Will Lee change? Maybe. One of my favorite Romo lines seemed to serve as a warning to Lee, “That same ambition often compromises the unselfish motives that began the quest.” Lee was genuinely surprised when Romo said they had found Laura’s successor and it was him. But it also struck me as naïve, even a little absurd. Lee perhaps had never actively sought out leadership roles, power and the responsibility that comes with both, but he accepted the jobs handed to him. And, more often than not, he rose to the challenges presented to him and enjoyed the respect and admiration he received. As Romo pointed out, his is a repressed ambition. It’s something he does share with Laura. Neither wanted nor longed for the jobs they were made to fill, yet they excelled at them and find themselves unable to walk away.

I think it’s important to separate power from ambition; the two attributes are too often confused with one another. In ‘The Ties That Bind’, Zarek stated that tyrants want power and Laura wanted to save them all. Lee, is very much of the same mindset, telling Romo, with a gun pointed at him, that he is going to make a difference in the fleet. It’s not about him, it’s about everyone else. Lee Adama and Laura Roslin are good people, they are selfless people, willing to die not just for friends and family, but for humanity, for a conviction. But at what point do good people and ideals get corrupted? At what point does Lee realize he can’t stop from becoming Laura?

OK, I had more to say than I thought.


Romo Lampkin

I love reading the thoughts of everyone on my Flist, but I have to admit there are a few people I use as a barometer to see if I’m missing something. Romo perplexed me. Romo’s cat perplexed me. I beat myself up for not picking up Lance was dead until late in the episode. But this afternoon I read pellucid’s thoughts and the comments on her post and I felt much better. Apparently, we were all confused.

I hasten to call Romo’s flirtation with insanity character development because I think it’s the first and last time we’ll see it. Because of that I don’t desire to spend much time or effort analyzing it. It is plausible we could discover a new dimension to Romo. We don’t really know Romo that well and I always suspected he had developed a façade. Now, we find out it was to mask the guilt and pain over his family’s death. And the cat was his last tie to his family and old life. When Lance died it triggered him to act in a way that would not just destroy Lee Adama, but, more importantly, would succeed in destroying himself. While I can fill in the blanks to make it all make some sort of sense, it’s still an out of the blue development with simplistic psychological reasoning.

It’s unfortunate the writers felt compelled to make Romo yet another deeply damaged character with family issues. Up until he pulled the gun on Lee, I was very happy with the characters return. I know the writers and fans wanted him back and the show found a good, logical way to integrate him into the story. The Quorum needed a legal expert and Lee needed a sounding board. That Romo would be the person Lee sought out made perfect sense.


Saul Tigh

I really liked Tigh in this episode. One reason was because there was zero Cylon paranoia. No not-so-secret meetings in which the final four sit around questioning their true nature and panicking about if they are going to be found out. And the one thing Tigh has been determined to do since finding out the truth is to do his job and he did that here. He called Adama on putting the welfare of one individual above the safety of the entire fleet (and wouldn’t Laura hate that?) and forced him (with an assist from Romo) to confront his feeling for Laura. He also knocked Adama on his ass for his blatant hypocrisy which I kind of love.

Still, making Saul Tigh admiral of the fleet, even temporarily seems like a very bad idea to me. Hell, even Tigh brings up what happened the last time he was in charge. Yes, I’ll give him the benefit of the doubt and say he learned from those mistakes as well as what happened on New Caprica and the aftermath of that, but, still! Though, it is interesting to worry about the implication of this change in command, not because Adama has put a Cylon in charge of the safety of the fleet, but because of Tigh’s very human failings.

Saul Tigh as a father may have been the most terrifying reveal of them all. It also throws the hybrid baby out with the Cylon bathwater. You would seem to neither need a human nor love in order to reproduce. (And if Caprica is having her own child now, how will that alter her view of Hera?)


William Adama

Will Bill finally tell Laura exactly how he feels when he finds her? If not, I’m going to be even more frustrated by their relationship. I really hope he isn’t just going to expect that his actions (stepping down from command, taking off alone in a raptor) will speak louder than words (“I love you”) because I’m getting quite tired of that crap. He’s, what?, sixty, not sixteen.

And I feared for awhile that we were going to see more of the Adama that I’ve come to loathe. Forget that Sharon broke a half dozen rules and regulations, most importantly, she betrayed a promise to him! He trusted her! Yes, he actually did just say it’s all about him! We also got a replay of YCGHA, with an interesting twist of Kara realizing he was making some very bad command decisions and questioning him.

But kudos for Adama finally admitting he had lost his objectivity. I was more shocked by the admission then him actually stepping down from command.


A few other random observations:

Poor Tom, doomed to be forever a bridesmaid. He’s tried to be the good politician for so long now. I enjoyed seeing, in a private moment with Lee, his bitterness and disappointment to finally boil over. He had expected Lee to return the favor and now support him in office. And I loved that he made an excellent point, unlike Laura, unlike Lee, he may not have been elected tp the presidency, but he’s the only one who has actually been elected to the office.

Jake! Ron made good on his promise to bring him back and bring relief to fans that feared he died on New Caprica. And, as a side note, Jamie strikes me as more of a dog person than a cat person. ;)

Did the basestar really destroy the resurrection hub? Off camera? Darn. I was looking forward to a big ship blowing up. :/

I’m a bit pissed they killed off Nathalie. I think they missed out on some interesting story possibilities there. And did she really see the light before she died? Really???
  • Current Mood: satisfied satisfied
I need to rewatch at least one more time before putting together some coherent meta of my own. But I do want to hone some of my ideas against yours.

I had a feeling you wouldn't be 100% thrilled about this episode, even with Jamie getting some of his best moments of the season. So much of what happened, especially with Romo, felt "off." On my second rewatch it was really obvious how awkward Romo's conversation with Bill was. I felt like huge hunks of the dialogue were cut. Bringing up the lighter came out of nowhere. Pulling the gun on Lee felt inauthentic to Romo's character. There was much confusion about the cat. And I'd also have to say, I am really left unsure whether Lee truly was making a play for power and using Lampkin to do it, or if Lee was truly that naive, duh, me, president? Either way you read it, it still doesn't read well and the writer/director's intention is just kind of unclear. And of course, showing Lee being sworn in the promo turned Romo's revelation into a duh moment.

I am very pissed they killed Nathalie as well, although the way she died made me wonder if Cottle is perhaps our 12th.

And Bill Bill Bill, I know he's your XO and your best friend, but he just knocked up a Cylon POW. Why in gods names are you putting him in command? But that being said, I think it's about frakking time that they gave Adama something to do and it did grow authentically out of his nothings he's been doing over the past 12 episodes or so. And I like that Razor makes it easier to stomach the old man being called Husker again and just going off in a raptor for his woman. Gee, and we wonder where Lee gets his romantic streak?

I don't know. I didn't hate it. But the editing felt off (like those weird moments of Sharon being thrown in. Grace was brilliant, but they felt oddly out of place). Also as much as I love my girl Kara, I am having a hard time believing her just being accepted as CAG particularly after what went down on the Demetrius. I think this is one of those episodes that could use another 10 minutes or so to finish those conversations and polish those rough edges.

And as I've stated elsewhere, I guarantee RDM will admit they went with Leland because Lee didn't sound "presidential" enough.


Bringing up the lighter came out of nowhere.

That threw me too. We know that Romo is very good at reading people, but there is no way he could have deduced that happening, Lee would have had to tell him about it. But would Lee share that story with Romo? Lee's very guarded with his feelings and we saw what an important moment that was with his father. I just have a hard time imagining a scenario in which Lee would have shared that with Romo.

Sharon should either have been left out of this episode or had her role expanded. As I said, this episode was about four people and her story, an important one, got lost in the mix. And then to end it with her being reunited with her daughter in the brig???
They shouldn't know latin.

It makes no sense. It's not the "ancient language" that the weirdo graffiti saying "sons of aries" was written in. It's not the language of their oracles.

I'm really bothered by this. I know it's a random thing to be pissed about, but it's like the writers were trying to show how wise and sophisticated they are (i.e. I'm smart, will you go out with me?) by dropping in some esoteric phrase they learned in their lit class, which is all about them, not the show or the world they're trying to create.

This bugs me because I see all the time how people try to invoke a "magic word" from antiquity to gain personal power for themselves. Like at my family's church, where they can't just have a coffee house, they have to have a maranatha coffee house. Because some hebrew word changes who they are in their own minds.

I once belonged to a political message board where there were about eight lawyers. The two female ones had very impressive trial jobs (rare among lawyers as you know), worked in DC, etc., while all the dudes were just guys with degrees (one was obsessed with legalizing pot, winnah!) who pushed paper. Anyway, the female ones went by their first names while ALL the male ones all had handles based on the names of famous Roman dudes.

Sine Qua Non my ass.


Also, still watching Xena for the first time (at the ep now where Claudia Black guests), which I had written off when it first aired. It's actually less cheesy than Star Gate Atlantis by an utterly huge magnitude. Which is very humbling, imo.
So far this season, we've had Zarek quote Lincoln and Baltar quote Shakespeare. Having Romo use Latin didn't really phase me. I'm hoping that these references are very deliberate. Maybe our culture is part of their culture. Maybe earth isn't the thirteenth colony, but the first where life began. Or maybe they are just full of themselves. ;)

It's actually less cheesy than Star Gate Atlantis by an utterly huge magnitude.

Sadly, not shocking me. I recently read an article about SGA. The entire piece was about Jason Momoa's/Ronon's hair. Forget character development and plot, they had massive discussions about his hair and the role it would play in the upcoming season.
Ideally, I would have liked a bit more of a reaction to Laura's abduction, but Lee's non-reaction didn't really bother me and I felt it was in character. He's shown time and again that he'll put the mission or the safety of the fleet above his personal feelings. In 'Rapture', while showing some reaction to news of Kara's raptor being shot down, he made it clear to Sam that they would continue with the mission they were assigned to carry out. He always chooses to focus on the crisis at hand, it's what Laura does as well. He's even relatively unemotional as he discusses his father's, as he sees it, suicide mission. It's because Lee now has the safety of the fleet and the welfare of every individual within it in his hands and he has to set his personal feelings aside.
This episode felt rather... slapped together. On one level, I was left asking why we had two episodes focussing on the Demetrius and Kara's personal quest together with the buildup to an entirely predictable mutiny, but the political chaos left after the absence of the president is dealt with in a single episode and with so little focus on characters outside the main four protagonists in this ep.

I liked seeing a lot of Lee, but again this felt like being dragged through the minimum possible number of scenes needed to achieve the end result - Lee as interim president - rather than creating a situation where that point felt like it had arrived organically.

I'd also like to point out I think it's a ridiculous storytelling gaff to go back to putting someone in the brig for shooting a Cylon when Anders the shinily perfect is walking around scot-free after maiming a senior officer.

There were a lot of things I liked about this episode - one being the call back to S1 with Kara pointing out that Adama is risking too much for one person. I remember one of the debates that went on in some factions of fandom about how Lee's a bastard for daring to ever leave anyone (read: Kara) behind in any situation and how Kara would never do that... and here's Kara demonstrating that actually she really is an officer. There were a lot of parallels here between children coming of age, but one of the things that came across clearly is that Adama hasn't changed. He may now be more willing to state what he wants, but in terms of command he's still making the same decisions the same way that he did back in S1. That feels... disappointing.

I'm starting to think that Adama's completely in the closet over his hidden love for Saul, and that his declarations about Laura are just a desperate covering mechanism. I'm running out of other plausible reasons for how else he could keep putting Saul Tigh in charge or announcing his unconditional support while Saul's busily engaged in ever more gigantic "WTF?" moments. Ok, at least we now know why he was wearing Admiral's pips a couple of episodes ago - second unit work going on where they forgot to change his uniform back. I still find it staggering that Adama would calmly hand command over to Saul hours after the two of them were beating each other up because Saul's been shagging a prisoner. At the very least, that leaves Saul open to a whole raft of military charges if you consider Six in any way human, and if you don't it's still dereliction of duty. Given that there is a massive philosophical grey area here over the treatment of prisoners, the responsibilities of humans as captors and conduct towards the enemy, it's still an incredible screw-up on Saul's level... and he's being promoted as a result?? If Adama's decision was based on Saul calling him out over Laura, they did a bad job of translating that through in a meaningful form.

There was something unnerving about Lee's first scene as President. Last episode, he was telling Laura that she owed the people answers. This episode, he and Zarek were talking about elections and responsibility... and in his first scene as president, we're shown Lee sitting in a room with no-one else present other than Jake, signing Executive Orders. Was that an intentional visual parallel to Laura, particularly with the way Tory came scurrying up to carry his paperwork away?

I was probably to busy talking to Pi online to catch exactly what'd happened to Romo's family, but the back and forth over whether his cat existed or not was something I enjoyed because they actually built it up and wove it into the episode. Seeing him as a catalyst was useful, but the transition from working names over to pulling guns while Lee delivers solemn speeches felt rushed and disorganised. I find it hard to believe that Lee could go from incredulity to election speeches in the space of 30 seconds.

I think ultimately this is going to be another episode that rewards on shallow levels while making those who are trying to focus on the plot tear their hair out. I hope someone hands Boppy a drink before she sees it, I think she's going to be having a few hair-pulling moments at how badly they're telling the story as they rush us from Important Moment to Important Moment.
but the political chaos left after the absence of the president is dealt with in a single episode and with so little focus on characters outside the main four protagonists in this ep.

As much as I love the political aspects of the show, I'm not sure how much more they could have shown of the legal and political wrangling. Zarek could have put up more of a fight, but it would have been a losing one with the military refusing to acknowledge him and the Quorum looking at Lee as a better choice for the job for numerous reasons.

I almost think we got too much of Lee. (I know, I'm shocked typing that too!) It was a foregone conclusion from the time Lee brought up they could select an interim president that it was going to be him. Who else was there? It's not like they would pick someone we don't know and aren't invested in. Maybe if they had played it more as Lee wanting the job and having to fight Zarek to get it. But while I see Lee regaining a sense of ambition and desiring more for himself, I still don't see him craving power so I'm not sure a battle for the presidency would have made much sense. I don't want the writers to destroy Lee's character after getting a handle on it again.

He may now be more willing to state what he wants, but in terms of command he's still making the same decisions the same way that he did back in S1. That feels... disappointing.

But it's in character. Adama isn't going to grow and change. I hate to say he's old and set in his ways, that's trivializing him and the situation, but, like others, he's trying to hold on to the way things were and hold on to the people he loves. And he's always made rash, ill-conceived choices when it comes to the people he cares about. Lee and Kara have left him, in a way, each following their own paths, their destiny's, and now I think there is a desperation in him to hold onto Laura. Which is especially tragic since she's dying and there is nothing he can do to stop that.

and in his first scene as president, we're shown Lee sitting in a room with no-one else present other than Jake, signing Executive Orders.

Actually, courtesy of the 40" HD, Lee was signing a press release. When I have some free time I might try reading it to see the spin he's putting on his rapid rise to power. ;)
phrase popped into my head, “full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.”

You know, I think everything I find weird about this episode can be summed up by the fact that I 100% agree and disagree with that statement at the same time, and I don't know why. o.O

Like...loads DID happen. SIGNIFICANT things happened. But I don't know what the mean. In itself that's not a bad thing. I think future episodes can help provide that context. Like you, I don't dislike this episode. I might actually go so far as to say I actively like it. I just...don't know what it means. This is a disconcerting feeling!

At what point does Lee realize he can’t stop from becoming Laura?

I fervently hope Lee gets to remain President for long enough to explore this question. One of the disappointments I had with the start of the series is that I realised we were no longer watching Laura learn to be the President and struggle with it, as we were in seasons one and the early part of season two. We were outside and she was the writers' tyrant-analogue. Like, not a "badguy" analogue - they're too intelligent for that. But...we stopped seeing why she was willing to do what she did, and I missed that. I think I will overflow with love if they show me that with Lee this time. OH STUPID MIDSEASON HIATUS!

Saul Tigh as a father may have been the most terrifying reveal of them all. It also throws the hybrid baby out with the Cylon bathwater. You would seem to neither need a human nor love in order to reproduce. (And if Caprica is having her own child now, how will that alter her view of Hera?)

OH THAT PLOT DEVELOPMENT! *trots out the trusty hysterical laughter that has been serving her well this week* AHAHAHAAHAAAAHA!

My assumption is that the Final Five are much more "human" than the Significant Seven. The bizarre and blurry difference between the two types of model and why that difference exists irritates me, but at least it has the nice side-effect of not ruining what we know about Cylon reproduction, at least among the Seven. If the Five reproduce exactly like humans, then this kid is, effectively, the second "miracle child" (since Nicky is a hybrid, but not one that ought to be impossible).

Though this does imply that Caprica Six loves Tigh. o.O

Or hey, perhaps the Final Five, once activated by strange Earth music, are the portable equivalent of that island on Lost! Though...that thought is somewhat terrifying. Kara better watch herself and Tory better hope she has really good birthcontrol. The thought of Baltarspawn is...horrific... /Crack.

And I feared for awhile that we were going to see more of the Adama that I’ve come to loathe. Forget that Sharon broke a half dozen rules and regulations, most importantly, she betrayed a promise to him! He trusted her! Yes, he actually did just say it’s all about him!

I have nothing to add. You sum it up beautifully. I mean I know that he will feel personally betrayed. That's fine. But he always, always makes it about that more than anything else. Tigh is a great example. He screws up again and again, but Adama's ire at him is never as deep or as lasting because he "only" put the entire Fleet at risk. At least he didn't personally betray Adama.

And I loved that he made an excellent point, unlike Laura, unlike Lee, he may not have been elected tp the presidency, but he’s the only one who has actually been elected to the office.

I also thought that was an excellent point. I mean, Laura legally ascended to the presidency, the first time. But that was because she was part of a line of succession in a legally elected administration, not because she was. I actually think I went on a massive rage about the way she got elected President the second time, that backroom switcharoo Zarek orchestrated. I wished that Ron Moore had simply written in an election. It's not like anyone would have voted for anyone else at that point.
I've come to realize that BSG may be the only show to get me to go WOO! and WTF? in the same episode. ;)
I should introduce you to Smallville... it takes that to extremes that you can't even begin to contemplate. But yeah. This episode also had a 'wtf' aspect for me though I deliberately tried to make my post about it positive simply because I've been such a misery-guts recently about BSG and I figured this was the one week I could try and enjoy it. :) I did enjoy it. But I had some problems with it.

Will Lee change? Maybe.
Yeah there was a bit of foreshadowing about that. *worries*

But at what point do good people and ideals get corrupted? At what point does Lee realize he can’t stop from becoming Laura?
Honestly, now that you put it out there, I kind of hope Lee doesn't last as president very long. Because I think they've clearly shown that that position corrupts. It makes me worry for him.

I had much worse case scenarios in mind after hearing Lee wasn’t his real name.
OMG! You found that out as a spoiler?! It's things like that that make me glad I'm spoilerphobic.

While I can fill in the blanks to make it all make some sort of sense, it’s still an out of the blue development with simplistic psychological reasoning.
It really worked for me (I'm honestly not kidding but I do seem to be alone in this so clearly I'm batshit) because the actor sold it so well and because I was really invested in his relationship with Lance. *straight face* Also I kind of felt like he was one of several characters displaying mental illness and distorted thought patterns in this episode--Tigh and Adama being the other two. And I think Romo worked for me as a metaphor for the fleet as a whole. Also, I really empathised with his feeling that humanity as a whole deserves to die. I'm not trying to argue with you because it didn't seem to work for a lot of people and I do agree it was fairly simplistic, but it did hang together for me.

I really liked Tigh in this episode. One reason was because there was zero Cylon paranoia.
YES! Thank you. That's why I liked him. *clicks*

it is interesting to worry about the implication of this change in command, not because Adama has put a Cylon in charge of the safety of the fleet, but because of Tigh’s very human failings.
I definitely found myself focusing on that as the issue rather than the Cylon-ness, and I think in part that's because of the direction, which, as you say, didn't include any Cylon paranoia. I found that a bit odd though, because this season has had so much about the Final Four ... it felt like a sudden return to the show I once liked about human characters, but it kind of pinged oddly for me because it didn't connect with the bigger plots of this season. I'm surprised they didn't make more of the fact that Adama was handing command over to a Cylon. The FF moments have been so anvilly in all other eps but not this one! Why?

The other thing I found really incongruous (I'm just offloading all this in your journal now, sorry!) was the way Kara was just back to being CAG as if nothing had happened. Earlier this season she was a screaming, flailing mess. As I understand it they're not actually physically that much closer to Earth yet, and yet suddenly she's able to wander around all fine? Just because she hooked up with some Cylons for a while? And why would her returning to the fleet and proposing an alliance with Cylon rebels make people any less suspicious that she was one. I don't buy that everyone would suddenly accept her this easily. She was so central to the first part of this season and in these last couple of eps she got shunted to the back again and it feels as if the writers just need her back as a normal officer so 'hey presto!' she is.

It also throws the hybrid baby out with the Cylon bathwater. You would seem to neither need a human nor love in order to reproduce.
Yup. I have massive issues with this because it makes the Farms even more chilling and awful. The Cylons are not doing themselves any favours in my eyes.

I’m getting quite tired of that crap. He’s, what?, sixty, not sixteen.
Ah, yes. This is what I was wondering through most of the ep.

Jamie seems like a dog person. *nods*
Honestly, now that you put it out there, I kind of hope Lee doesn't last as president very long. Because I think they've clearly shown that that position corrupts. It makes me worry for him.

Even if he were to be president for quite a long time (which I don't think will happen), I don't believe Lee would be corrupted. Laura has changed in her time as president, but has she been corrupted? I's say she's probably disappointed in some of the choices she has had to make. Lee is going to be faced with some of those same difficult choices and, intellectually, he seems to have come to the point where he sees why Laura has done what she has done, but he really hasn't had to shoulder all that responsibility himself yet. And we know how overly critical of himself and guilt ridden he can be. Unlike so many others, he still, as you pointed out in your post, has some hope and some optimism. He still believes that humanity can be saved and that they can, once again, be the people they once were, perhaps even better, learning from the horrors they have lived through. But will he come to see that the future he envisions is not possible? I just worry about him becoming even more broken after he's finally begun to heal.

OMG! You found that out as a spoiler?! It's things like that that make me glad I'm spoilerphobic.

And it was from a mutual friend. ;)

I'm surprised they didn't make more of the fact that Adama was handing command over to a Cylon. The FF moments have been so anvilly in all other eps but not this one! Why?

Good point and good question? I guess we could argue that Tigh was too much in shock from a) finding out he was going to be a daddy and b) just being handed the safety of the fleet. Maybe we should have had one more scene with Tigh, alone, looking into a mirror or reaching for a bottle, showing that he was really struggling with this responsibility knowing what he knows about himself.

The other thing I found really incongruous (I'm just offloading all this in your journal now, sorry!) was the way Kara was just back to being CAG as if nothing had happened.

I'm with you. While I appreciated sane, in control Kara, it didn't make a lot of sense. You're right, she's a suspected Cylon and brings a basestar back with her which, oh, just kidnapped the president and she's back to being the CAG and not under suspicion by anyone? And why did her migraines suddenly stop? And, if they did, wouldn't she suspect that means they are heading in the right direction? Unfortunately, I think this is one of those cases where, for story purposes, they needed Kara to act in a certain way and just ignored everything that went on with her character since the start of the season.

Edited at 2008-05-31 02:47 am (UTC)
he seems to have come to the point where he sees why Laura has done what she has done, but he really hasn't had to shoulder all that responsibility himself yet.
That's true. I think living with it himself though could ... yeah, break him. Because I think Laura's better at giving herself a break and thinking she's right, that she really is justified, even if it's unpleasant. Perhaps that makes her stronger than Lee.

He still believes that humanity can be saved and that they can, once again, be the people they once were, perhaps even better, learning from the horrors they have lived through. But will he come to see that the future he envisions is not possible? I just worry about him becoming even more broken after he's finally begun to heal.
That's sort of my worry, but I guess I think that he might be led to disillusionment by having to take some difficult measures himself. I think he'd find it challenging to become as autocratic as Laura has become, and yet he might find himself on that path for the same reasons she has. I don't think this will actually happen because I don't think he will be Pres long. But if it did, I'd be pretty distressed for him.

Maybe we should have had one more scene with Tigh, alone, looking into a mirror or reaching for a bottle, showing that he was really struggling with this responsibility knowing what he knows about himself.
It felt like that to me. I came away feeling like there was a missing link. But maybe they'll build that into the next ep.

why did her migraines suddenly stop? And, if they did, wouldn't she suspect that means they are heading in the right direction? Unfortunately, I think this is one of those cases where, for story purposes, they needed Kara to act in a certain way and just ignored everything that went on with her character since the start of the season.
Yup. I actually think Kara's been really ill-used by the writing team this season. It feels like she's whatever they want her to be for the purposes of whichever episode she's in. She's been really compelling at times, and I too enjoyed seeing sane Kara back again: I just wish it was a little more logical a progression for her character.
Because I think Laura's better at giving herself a break and thinking she's right, that she really is justified, even if it's unpleasant. Perhaps that makes her stronger than Lee.

Lee is much more about second guessing himself. He can make a decision on the spot, but, afterwards, he can spend years debating with himself if it was the right call. That can be a good thing, especially for a leader, as he discussed with Laura in '33', but it can also cause a lot of wear and tear on the psyche of the individual.
I love wanderers! :)

He shot the Olympic Carrier down on orders and that was hard enough, but could he give the order, with no one to answer to but his own soul?

I don't know if you listen to the podcasts or are familiar with discussions of the deleted scenes from the eps that have aired thus far. In 'Six of One' there was a conversation between Lee and Adama that, for several reasons, I was ultimately glad was cut, but it did raise an interesting point and one I think we have, subtly, seen play out. Adama explains to Lee that, at some point he is going to miss being a pilot because he's no longer going to be one of those people who will be able to answer the call when the fleet is in danger. Instead, he’ll be one of the people who need to be protected and it’s going to bother him.

In 'Guess What's Coming to Dinner' Lee expressed t Laura how helpless he felt on Colonial One during the emergency jump, his first time having his fate in someone else's hands. And in this episode, we saw how troubled he was by Galactica unexpectedly jumping away. We've also seen his frustration at being out of the loop, the Quorum looking to him for answers and he not having any for them. I thought it was interesting that as we saw the Quorum delegates panic and exchange rumors as to what was happening, Lee was speaking to one of the marine guards. I'm sure he is still friendly with many in the military and they are inclined to share information with him.

But getting back to your question, yes, he could give the order if he had to, but it would way heavily on him. The Olympic Carrier is never far from his mind, but if he had to have been to one to give the order it would have been even worse. We've seen him struggle with command decisions. In 'Razor' he had to come to terms with ordering Kara to stay behind and explode the nuke. He can do it, but it chips away at his soul. And I think he realizes he had to step in now, but I also think he knows he's not fully prepared for the responsibility he must shoulder. Or maybe he is, but he's seen first hand what it's done to Laura, her ideals and her soul, and he's worried a bit for himself.
Forget that Sharon broke a half dozen rules and regulations, most importantly, she betrayed a promise to him! He trusted her!

I HATED that. He said she put the whole fleet in danger! And he thinks his hurt feeligns are more important! That just proves he had lost his ability to lead the fleet.