Asta 2

Yes, another BSG related post, but also evidence I watch other shows

Thanks to a headache combined with eye strain (likely brought on by too much time on the net, go figure), many of you have probably already read Mo Ryan’s Q&A with Jane Espenson and Ryan Mottesheard about ‘No Exit’. There were several comments that peaked my interest.

Ryan: Initially, much of the action in “No Exit” was designed to play through a few episodes. However, as the Cavil/Ellen story takes place over the course of 18 months since Ellen’s death on New Caprica, the intercutting between base ship past and Galactica present started to get confusing and we felt that distilling into one episode would be the best approach.

I have to agree that would have potentially become confusing. And as much as I felt overwhelmed by all the information being thrown at me at once, I do wonder if I would have felt frustrated getting pieces of information over the course of several episodes.

Ryan: John/Cavil is the only one who knows the Final Five because he corrupted the programming of the other six models to never speak of the Final Five or search for their identities. Obviously, if they did, then his little house of cards topples, which is why he boxed D’Anna.

D’Oh! It hadn’t occurred to me that Cavil is the one responsible for the “We can’t speak of the Five” programming.

Jane: The dates and sequence of the events surrounded Pythia and Kobol are going to be explored, I understand, in a comic book being written by Seamus Kevin Fahey [who is a "Battlestar" writer] and David Reed.

Why must shows force us to read the comic books to find out details?

Jane: The Final Five were polytheists until they met the Centurions, who were monotheists.

This was a little unclear to me in the episode. It creates some interesting questions which I wonder if they will address.

Ein Staunender: Will we get more information about this [previously] unknown colony [mentioned by Cavil in one of his conversations with Ellen]? Is it possibly founded or inhabited by people from earth? Or descendants/incarnations of the Final Five?

Jane: Oh, you mean The Colony? You're assuming it's a colony?

I didn’t mention Cavil’s reference to a colony in my recap and I haven’t seen many others question the reference, but it looks like we have another important reveal forthcoming.

Adamachief Lori C: The only [moment] in "No Exit" that gave me pause was when Adama refused Chief's offer of Cylon technology to fix Galactica. After all, Adama was the one pushing for the installation of Cylon FTLs throughout the fleet, leading to the mutiny which just ended. Why was he so hesitant, especially with Galactica in such dire shape?

Jane: This is about replacing the very bones of Galactica. About her not being her anymore, about Adama being forced to acknowledge the disease that's taking her away. It's about turning to the Cylons not just to help us but to make us and them the same. I see it as being an order of magnitude beyond the earlier decision.

Ryan: On some level, Adama is owning up to his responsibility for the mutiny – what was Lee’s line in The Oath about Zarek being right? – and is therefore reluctant to forge a deeper reliance on Cylon tech after the devastation it wrought. (Laura too, acknowledges her own responsibility by passing the baton to Lee.) Further, Adama is unwilling to accept that Galactica is in as bad shape as Tyrol says and his story in this episode is about him finally facing that fact.

It looks like we were meant to see definite parallels between the ship and Laura, at least according to Jane’s comments. And I agree with Ryan abut Laura, it was subtle, but I saw her accepting responsibility for her role in the mutiny, though I didn’t see that tied to passing the baton to Lee. If she wasn’t gravely ill, maybe. But Adama accepting responsibly by backing off from a deeper reliance? I didn’t get that. Perhaps because we’ve seen him so many times have one set of rules for himself and one set for everyone else. To me, it was fine to upgrade every other ship in the fleet, but no one was touching his.

Justin: One thing that I wished was addressed in last night's episode, and wasn't, was the fate of the mutineers other than Gaeta and Zarek. What happened to Racetrack, Narcho, and Seelix?

Ryan: Mr. Angeli addressed this point quite subtly (and definitively) I thought in the previous episode when we saw Kelly flip-flop and Adama offer mutineers the opportunity to recommit their allegiances during his final march towards CIC.

Well, crap. I wanted to see more fallout.

And Mo has also posted a Q&A with Tahmoh. But it deals with his work on Dollhouse and not BSG.

As for other TV this week…


The series got off to a strong start this season. The show hit a bit of a bump with Chuck’s evil ex returning. But the last two episodes I’ve felt rather ‘meh’. And the reason is Chuck and Sarah or, more precisely, their relationship. I’m over it. They either need to split them up, permanently, or make them a couple. I don’t buy the crap that putting two characters together ruins a show. In the case of a show like Moonlighting, Dave and Maddie having sex wasn’t the issue, it was everything that happened after that. And then there is The X-Files where keeping the two apart made no damn sense, especially after they had a baby together! A perfect example of a show that made a relationship work over the course of the series (with, granted, A LOT, of problems along the way) was Farscape. It can be done.

And I’m at a loss as to why Chuck and Sarah can’t be together romantically. They’re worried it will interfere with their work if they become emotionally involved. Well, clearly it’s too late for that because they are already emotionally involved. They’re already making mistakes, if you can call it that, because of how much they care for one another. I would agree that letting the higher ups know might be a bad idea, but they can sneak around. I doubt even Casey would out them.


Not only have I seen Mark Sheppard on three shows in two weeks, one of his henchman, Alex Carter (thank you imdb), costarred with him in last week’s episode of Burn Notice! The repairing sort of took me out of the episode, especially since they were playing similar characters.

Overall, I found this to be one of the more entertaining episode of the season. And I give the show credit for risk taking. How many series destroy their base of operations before the first season is over?

What I liked…

• Nate admitting he is an alcoholic, albeit a “functioning alcoholic”.

• Instead of staging an intervention, a revengention.

• Hardison’s interest in Sophie’s art history lesson. Which ended up making a lot of sense when he forced Eliot to go back to retrieve the painting he painted.

• Continuity! Nate tells his former boss if he’s not interested in the statue he knows “a Canadian oil man who needs something for his shelf”. Heh.

• Christian’s hair is (no pun intended) growing on me. And he looks good in glasses.

• Referring to Nate and Maggie as “very Nick and Nora”. Hee!

• Parker and Hardison pretending to makeout, Paker not realizing Hardison is into her, Nate and Eliots’ reaction to the kiss, and their not knowing if she was kissing Hardison or Sophie.

What I had a problem with…

• Maggie seemed a little cold to me. She believes her husband, who she supposedly still cares about, is down on his luck and she offers him her couch in her office?

• And that Maggie didn’t know the insurance claim was denied seems suspect. Even if Nate tried to shield her from the pain of the truth, I can’t believe she wouldn’t have heard from the doctors or hospital as to why a treatment was available, but wasn’t performed. And if they weren’t forthcoming with the information, we’re to believe she didn’t ask questions.

• I understand we need to see the team communicate with each other via their mics and earpieces, but they‘re talking to each other in front of other people and no one is questioning their behavior?

Life - I don’t have much to say other than it was enjoyable (accept for the parts with Ted which seemed a bit odd), but one thing kept bothering me. The actress who played the insurance investigator looked familiar. I realized she had played Tony Blair’s wife in The Queen, but it there was something else about her I was struggling to recall. It hit me this morning. She’s Damien’s wife!
The dates and sequence of the events surrounded Pythia and Kobol are going to be explored, I understand, in a comic book


I'm not sure why this fills me with RAGE, but it does. I think because I feel like this is surely VERY IMPORTANT INFORMATION that should be addressed in the show, and if it isn't, then maybe I'm WRONG about it being important, and...argh!

This is why I shouldn't read interviews and other extra-textual commentary. It only ends in tears.
I am so with you. Basically, if you can't get across all of the information you need to get across to make sense of your show IN THE SHOW, then you have FAILED AT STORYTELLING. Requiring people to buy supplemental comic books just to follow along is not an acceptable plan B.
And how difficult would it be to fit the information in the show? I would think a few lines of dialogue or perhaps a scene would help clarify why certain dates don't seem to jive. I suspect we are going to get a comic exploring what happened two thousand years ago and when will people learn prequels generally suck?
Well here's the thing, I don't think exact dates for the Kobol exodus are VERY IMPORTANT INFORMATION. YMMV.
I should clarify: the dates themselves aren't that important to me, really. I mean, I would like to know because I'm the kind of person who would totally hang the timeline on my wall and then write fic about it, but I don't think the dates are everything. I do, however, think that whatever it was that happened on Kobol is going to be very key--who created whom, what's up with the Lords of Kobol anyway, what's the deal with the opera house, etc. Or at least I did think that until this information--because why would they have stuff about Kobol and not toss in the dates? Surely the dates alone aren't important enough for comic books. So I conclude that it's all the Kobol stuff that may well get shoved into a comic book, and that makes me rather upset.
I'll be pissed off too if the Kobol stuff is pushed into the comic books, too. But I can't see that happening, since as you say - at least the Opera House stuff is still to be resolved and that's very much about Kobol.

Also, I'm all for exact chronologies and time lines but I think the general 2000 years ago sort of approximation we've always had will suffice. Plus I'm not sure they've exactly been consistent on that in the series, so I can't see a comic book fixing that anyway.
When I read the comment you were the first person I thought of. ;) I know the timeline has always been of importance to you and in a recent post you mentioned researching it more to see if you could get a better grasp of it. We have been giveny contradictory dates for certain key events and now with the Big Damn Exposition you would think we'd be getting some clarification with the series coming to an end. I can't say I'm filled with rage, but I'm annoyed that I have to spend money I something I never spend money on to see the entire picture.

Hey, if you didn't read interviews then you'd be waiting for answers that will not be forthcoming and be even more frustrated!
But if I didn't read the interviews I would only be frustrated at the end, and not anxious and frustrated the whole way through! :)
At the end of Chuck, as we got the solemn tie up where Chuck tells Ellie that he and Sarah will never be that couple, I was like, "Really? Didn't we already have that lesson? Like, repeatedly?"

I though we'd get a break from this when Chuck had to get over that, wait, Sarah's a spy and she uses lethal force when needs to, like she always has. Apparently not. I agree. They need to come toa conclusion and not have a moment of mope every single episode because though I find the pairing to have some endearing moments, it's dragging down the pace in many many ways.
"Really? Didn't we already have that lesson? Like, repeatedly?"

Heh. Yes, exactly. I thought they had decided to maintain only a professional relationship, but apparently playing house for a day changes all that. And I had some issues with Sarah playing the happy homemaker beyond the act for the neighbors. I was waiting for her to reveal she was an accomplished cook and had missed having opportunities to prepare a meal, but, no she just wanted to cook Chuck's breakfast. The suburban scenario was about as subtle as a sledgehammer and the end just fell apart as Chuck, again, lamented his relationship (or lack thereof) with Sarah.
And I give the show credit for risk taking. How many series destroy their base of operations before the first season is over?

It made me think of Angel; I can't think of any other examples.

I pretty much loved all of the scenes between Hardison and Parker in this episode, and the way he was both appalled and fascinated by her break-in strategy, and got all stammery and wanted to talk about the making out.
I'd forgotten about Angel (which is weird given Christian's involvement), but it was also kind of an extension of Buffy and Joss is known for his share of jawdroppers. I suppose I was surprised that such a mainstream show with a fairly predictable outcome each week shook things up so soon.

I'm really warming to Parker. Maybe she was so over the top early on so we'd see the humanizing effect the team would have on her.
Yes, the colony is an interesting thing that I didn't expect to be addressed - obviously they had to have some planet on the other side of the Armistice line where they built their armies and the skinjobs. New Earth perhaps?

It's odd what jumped out at me even in my original viewing - but the Centurions are monotheists was one, only briefly discussed by Ellen. (The other thing was Sam saying that Tyrol thought he had a chip in his head, back on Earth - which you can barely hear!)
New Earth perhaps?

Hmmm, interesting thought. And maybe that earth is our earth? I still feel our earth has to play a role in the series and I don't feel that the Cylon earth is it.

I always assumed that the Earth they found was our Earth - and that perhaps the "all this has happened before" cycle began there. So in essence, we go to the stars, settle Kobol, live there for a long time until we create the Thirteenth Tribe... and the story continues from there.

I'm not too concerned about Our Earth being part of the narrative, although if the Cylon colony turns out to be our Earth - well played Mr Moore, well played.

Parker and Hardison pretending to makeout, Paker not realizing Hardison is into her, Nate and Eliots’ reaction to the kiss, and their not knowing if she was kissing Hardison or Sophie.

Haha omg. I didn't notice that they weren't sure who she was kissing. *falls over laughing*
I watch Chuck mostly for Buymoria and the actor playing Chuck. The Chuck/Sarah stuff? Nah.
Re: Agreed
I watch the Casey/Elly/Awesome show. And has someone written that fic yet? ;)